Oh yet We Trust

I have done it before my custody battle for my boy. I kept reporting to the police about a little boy next door to me that was being abused everytime they came they came to see me telling me that there was no bruising in the end they told the Mother to take out an AVO against me i was so appauled i went down to the court here in Ballina and repsented myself, i asked my first witness who was one of the police that came to my home on at least five occasions "What state was i in each time he came when he came to my home?" he answered i was in a shocking state I asked why and he said that I told him i was like this becuase i was dealing with the Church listening to the child being abused" I then asked him to take out his note book (which is a bible to them) and tell me the dates and what he had written each time he came" and guess what he had written down nothing. The whole thing was thrown out in seconds I bowed and left head held high ofcourse.

Macbee

You go girl! I'd have you represent me any day.

http://brokenrites.alphalink.com.au/nletter/page229-finian-egan.html

http://www.abc.net.au/7.30/content/2012/s3493286.htm

Sadly, there is also a practical side as to why some people get bail - there are not enough cells to hold everyone being charged, so those not deemed a severe risk or who are able to post bail are allowed out.

when I worked in Correctional Centres, 20 years ago but I wouldn't expect it to be much different now, every Friday afternoon Police would come and ask us how many could be released that weekend so there would be cells for those they had warrants for but could not serve them for reasons of space, or they expected trouble on the weekend and needed to know there would be accommodation for anyone picked up.

What is a desperate need, but no one wants to think about it as it is skating on thin ice re civil rights, is the provision of secure facilities for people picked up either drunk or overdosed, where they HAD to be kept for a minimum of 7 days, preferable 21, until they had dried out and could be assessed as to competence to be released. If people had a nasty awakening on their first or early event, perhaps some would be unwilling to line up again. At present, unless the person consents, no Doctor, Police or family can ask for this.

James

I swore on the bible that no court would ever treat me so badly again even if i have to represent myself in the highest court in the land. When i finially got into the childrens court while i was going for custody of my Grandson after all the things that the other side were saying about me i was denied Legal Aid i only got inside after four court cases as my Daughters witness, the lawyer i had and was paying for myself had a death in the family on that first day and wanted to get it put off until the next day, i refused this and said i would represent myself, I walked in that court with my head up dressed just like the lawyers that were fighting to take my grandson away from his family and when the Magistrate asked where my legal adviser was i stood up slowely and said i was there to represent myself and that is exactly what i did, i tore them to threads with a strong voice and over the next month i walked out of there with my boy. that head honcho woman called me the "GRANDMOTHER FROM WOOP WOOP" when she lost her case to the old Lismore Girl with no education..as i said when i left the court when i looked at her in my mind "Never mess with an old Lismore Girl and you will never ever learn that from a book" I finially got Legal Aid to pay a month later

AMEN

Macbee

Roy

Thanks for standing up for me..I do not think i wil ever get over how they idolized my abuser in the cathedral in death and then in the Catholic Weekly this is the main reason that i cannot and will not reconect with my Church, can you imagine me walking into Mass in Lismore and the only thing i could see in my mind was his coffin sitting there because that is how my mind sees it now. In regards to the Priest that got married i was floored to see she was from over seas, he seemed nice enough and am intersted in what else he will have to say..has he been x.communicated????
Roy i feel i will be hearing things about the Church, ugly terrible things to the day i die..How sad it makes me feel.

Love macbee

James

I do agree too many people get bail when they should not be allowed. I understand he has to go through the process of the law now and the law must treat the survivors with the respect they deserve, let them speak and tell their story, not allow the big time lawyers to accuse them of making such a shocking thing up, what sought of person would do such a thing and put themselves through so much accusation, the world is a terrible place sadly.

Macbee

just needs a few tweaks and it can be perfect

The real injustices in the legal system are not the dirt poor people who get representation through Legal Aid, but those of modest means who don't pass the means test and have to pay for representation themselves. That is where the real injustice lies.

But you don't throw the baby out with the bathwater by getting rid of bail - unless you want to live in a police state where the mere fact of being accused of something is enough to put you behind bars.

Hold the ladder steady mate of course i know what BAIL is and why they set BAIL i am 62years old you know.

Then why get so publically upset about it being granted?

You are right James ...no point in getting publically upset as some will target you!
'Just heard in the car he got BAIL!!! This sought of thing i didn't need to hear just on my way home from my counsillor...'Reasonable I would have said ...usually in my own circle you don't get bail ..and you get a kicking when they arrest you.

Unfortunately James we can't all be in that 'special' group that get barristers being at the charge desk when you are being charged and no knee in the back and thrown on the ground regardless when you are arrested.

Special people are treated differently.

I was upset he got bai;l too ......I'll bet you my balls that if the situation was reversed I wouldn't get bail that is for sure.
special special people being protected for far too long!

and don't tell me they don't skip ...how many escaped over seas .......should I list them here or would that be seen as being crankily going over them.

here watch the vid and see how the Attorney generals been involved.
http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/its-been-33-years-in-the-making-expriest-charged-over-sexual-...

Priest faces up to 1980s abuse charges
http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/its-been-33-years-in-the-making-expriest-charged-over-sexual-...

Thanks for the suggestion, herbie, but rather than a Roman condo, I should have the right to reside in Chez Pell, because ever since His Eminence's Q&A Ex Cathedra pronouncement, that atheists (and, I suppose a fortiori, agnostics, poor hesistant souls that they are) can get into the Kingdom of Heaven, surely that would give me the right to reside as a pilgrim to nothing or at least uncertainty, in that Kingdom on Earth, Domus Australia. And, no, I am not familiar with the Taverns of Rome, which is all the more reason for me to become a pilgrim, and have my liver cleansed in the pale ales of Domus Australia.

As for starting up a practice as a Canonical Lawyer to assist the myriad priests and religious who are being charged with the latest heresy, namely that the current Pope was in large measure responsible for the cover up of clergy sex assaults on children,(yet another Error to be added to the Syllabus) I came across something below, which sounds like a much better little earner:

The April 26-27 Rome conference focused on canon 1095 of the Code of Canon Law, which allows a marriage to be declared null if one of the parties lacked the ability to consent because of “causes of a psychic nature.” Of the 15 to 20 possible grounds for an annulment in church law, more are granted on the basis of canon 1095 than all others combined, roughly two-thirds of the total.

As a result, some wags have dubbed canon 1095 the “loose canon.”

Over the centuries, church courts typically interpreted the capacity to consent fairly narrowly – as long as someone was of age, not coerced and not clearly insane, they were presumed to be capable. Yet as divorce has become more common, there’s often a powerful pastoral drive to find grounds for an annulment, given that a Catholic whose marriage breaks up can’t get remarried in the church without one, and if they remarry under civil law, they’re excluded from the sacraments.

Some critics argue that the pastoral desire to help people in difficulty has led to an overly elastic interpretation of canon 1095.

Sheila Rauch Kennedy, who successfully fought to overturn an annulment granted to her husband, then-U.S. Congressman Joseph Kennedy, in 1997, has written that church courts in America have adopted such an expansive reading of canon 1095 that it can now cover “almost anything ... from personality traits such as self-centeredness, moodiness or being eager to please, to unproven ‘disorders’.”

The "tightening up" of Canon Law raises wonderful mental gymnastics (which always bring in higher fees) because of that arcane legal system's insistence that it is not "divorcing" people, which implies that a marriage was perfectly valid, but it has now been ended by decree. Canon Law does not "end" marriages by decree. It simply declares them "null and void", ie it is as if the marriage never occurred.

Now, if the rules are to be "tightened up" that seems to imply that there are hordes out there, especially, according to the article, in the United States, whose marriages have not really been "null and void", despite their framed annulment documents (are they in colourful script, like those old Papal Blessings?).

I can see a good little earner there, with thousands of victims of null annulments flocking to my Canonical office to get their final vengeance against that bastard (or bitch, as the case may be)to have their annulments declared "null and void". This, effectively puts the other side to this unfortunate but lucrative litigation in the Fires of Hell for all eternity, as they bonk away mortally with their new partners. What greater sweet vengeance can a broken heart hope for?

Care to join me for a vino rosso in your favourite Tavern? It's on me.

Hold the ladder steady mate of course i know what BAIL is and why they set BAIL i am 62years old you know.

Then why get so publically upset about it being granted?

James

Hold the ladder steady mate of course i know what BAIL is and why they set BAIL i am 62years old you know.

Macbee

Thanks, James, for - once again - such a clear explanation of a legal situation (bail for Finian Egan).

We know you have strong connections with the Latin American continent. How about shelving that for a couple of years and taking up a condominium in Rome so that you could offer services to the increasing numbers of simple, honest, conscientiously informed and trying (=endeavouring) priests who are being warned, called to order, silenced, sacked, invited to Rome...

... there you could meet them, greet them, assure them of your acquaintance with Canon Law, even with the Napoleonic code - is that the right expression? - under which the western Europeans (east of The Channel) grew up, and, of course, include an indication of the modest scale of your fees (jack them up for those who belong to religious orders), and at the least you might get to a position where you could write an expose on the arcane legal procedures across the borders from Italy.

For some reason, Jonathan Swift comes to mind. Yes, you could do it all in that style.

Give it a thought. Are you familiar with the taverns of Rome? If my memory holds up, I could recommend one or two. OK, if it begins to work out, you could keep in touch and I could end up in one of them with you. (We could pretend to ignore the couple of monsignori in the dark corner.)

With that project in mind, I recall once again Julia O'Faolain's novel The Judas Cloth . Obtainable online from usebook sites. An absolutely brilliant panoply of mid-19th century Papal politics [Pio Nono, i. e., IX: 'LA TRADIZIONE: SONO IO - 'the Christian tradition: that's me'] and human drama (I am waiting on her Women in the Wall, a novel about the magisterial Radegund of the 6th century Frankish kingdom. After a worldwide search, the book will arrive this week from Fyshwick (Canberra for those not familiar with our bookselling capital).

Just heard in the car he got BAIL!!! This sought of thing i didn't need to hear just on my way home from my counsillor...

Macbee, you don't seem to understand what bail is about. We have a legal principle that is for your protection as much as anyone else's which says that a person charged is innocent until proven guilty.

The whole purpose of bail is to make sure that the person turns up at court the next time. It has nothing to do with presumed guilt, or with a finding that they are innocent. They are presumed to be innocent, and that would apply to you if someone made an allegation against you and you were charged with some crime.

The sorts of things that the court takes into account in determining to grant bail are the person's ties to the community, whether or not they have skipped bail before, their past record etc.

I'm not surprised that Egan was granted bail. After all, these allegations have been splashed all over the media for some time, so he has had plenty of time to skip the country. Apparently he hasn't. Granting him bail has nothing to do with the reliability or otherwise of the charges against him. It simply means that the court is confident that he is likely to turn up to face the charges with whatever bail conditions have been applied to him.

Helen

Just heard in the car he got BAIL!!! This sought of thing i didn't need to hear just on my way home from my counsillor, for some reason i was talking a lot about my childhood this time, it usually is about my job as care giver to jackson, we worked out that some of his little action when he is angry reminds of myself so much as a child.

macbee

http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/its-been-33-years-in-the-making-expriest-charged-over-sexual-...

I've just had an email in from a journalist colleague that Finian Egan was going to be charged charged by NSW Poilice at Ryde Police Station this morning. No further details at this stage.