No Delusion (Spirituality & Prayer)

by Warren , Wednesday, August 17, 2011, 18:17 (646 days ago) @ Brian Coyne

Brian, you say
Warren, I honestly think you delude yourself if the whole church is going to engage in meditation along the lines you are suggesting. I think, to some extent, that Benedict is correct in his description of the average Christian as a "simple person". We're simply never going to see all Christians one day engaging in some form of Christian yoga gazing blankly into space or contemplating their navels or the gentle sounds of their breathing.

It seems to me to be quite reasonable to say that all Christians should meditate but whether they actually do or not is another matter. I did point out that St. Teresa of Avila said that there are different stages of Christianity and not all are at the same stage. She actually said that there are seven stages in all and contemplation started at stage four and good Christians who are not engaged in contemplative prayer are at about stage three. So I do not consider that I am deluded.

None of us have time to study all the big questions:

I did carefully point out that it is the scientists who will figure out the big questions and the rest of us will not be studying the big questions. The rest of us have to find some other way of coming to terms with unity and the history of thousands of years all around the world has only come up with one answer and that is that we can get beyond reason by stopping the mind with contemplation.

What can change is the "paradigm" or "mindframe" in which the great majority perceive of their place in the world. What's changing today is "the mindframe". But it is a slow process.

Quite so. I did not suggest that change would happen overnight. I expressly pointed out that it would probably happen in the way that, as the Bible frequently mentions, yeast or leaven works and, so far as I know, the point of that analogy is simply say that it is a slow process. So yes it will be slow.

I think where you and I differ in our outlook is that you seem to posit that "meditation is the answer to everything".

That is not correct. I said there must also be action. I pointed out that the Jesuits say that we should be contemplatives in action which can only mean that there must be contemplation and there must also be action.

I also pointed out that this is the same as Zen saying that the Return to the Market Place is always necessary and the Return to the Market Place is just another way of saying contemplation is not enough and there must also be action.

I really cannot see how I could have made it any clearer. There must be both contemplation and action.