"Was Jesus Divine?" What does this mean? (Main Forum)

by Liz, Monday, February 08, 2010, 13:09 (1228 days ago) @ vynette

Vynette,

In reference to the above excerpts from Mark Roberts blog, they really needed to be read within the context of the developing proposition he was making in relation to the question of whether or not Jesus was divine. I posted excerpts to allow readers the taste of some of the topics he explores in doing this. He has presented a number of ideas as to why Jesus may have been considered divine in both his ministry whilst alive, and the early Christian communities that sprung up afterwards. He does not come to any concrete solution at the end, but leaves the facts (as he sees them), open for others to explore the question for themselves. On a personal level, it must be stated that he does indeed believe Jesus to be divine.

And I think this is what is needed in better appreciating scripture, is by reading it, not only with the help of scripture scholars and theologians, but bringing the spirit of the letter to such readings. This includes our own spirit in attempting to work out our faith with ‘fear and trembling’. Otherwise, what then is ‘faith’, especially without a ‘free will’ to explore the reality for ourselves and in our relationship with God? You profess yourself that you deliberately choose to remain devoid of emotion in your writings, offering instead to simply present the facts as you have found them in your exploration of the Jewish/Hebrew understanding of the gospels, as opposed to the further layers of Greek/Hellenistic thought placed upon them. And I have been appreciative of your research on this. But can faith be based on reason alone? Is there a divine element within all of this? I think it incredibly interesting to view all of this as different communities responses to the revelation of God, made known through Jesus. But the task for us still lies within the responsibility of answering the question of ourselves ie “Who do you say that I am?” It will serve no one to be dictatororial in response to this question, as it is beautifully extended as an invitation by Jesus himself.

If your stance is not one of faith, but of merely seeking to debunk Catholic doctrine, I would have to say that IMHO, it does not hold any value, for your motives are purely political, rather than ‘faith seeking understanding’. You may well ‘junk’ Catholic history, but you scream out when someone attempts to ‘junk’ Israel’s history. I would not be a fan of using this term ‘junking’, for this serves only to ‘annihilate’ the incredible embodiment of the human history caught up in it, but what I do see, far more clearly, is different bodies of people attempting to come to terms with their faith in their own circumstances. Personally, I see a beautiful pattern emerging from all this combined faith experience in history, and it’s implications for us on a personal level.

Please read these statements you make in the context of the whole passage. It was far too long to post, and I simply attempted to post excerpts on the kinds of topics he deals with.

“Once again, the principle of delegation has been ignored even though the entire Bible testifies to YHVH delegating authority to perform his works to humans of his choice.”

This topic he deals with in the context of his blog. He recognizes that this has been the case and discusses it further. A note of interest here is that Jesus did not refer to himself as the messiah.

Jesus is not "enthroned in heaven." There are actually two thrones - one in Heaven and one on Earth. God reigns in Heaven and God's delegate, Jesus, reigns on Earth -

"Behold, I stand at the door and knock: if any man hear my voice and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me. He that overcomes, I will give to him to sit down with me in my throne, as I also overcame, and sat down with my Father in his throne." (Rev. 3:20-21)

So I suppose the question is, Vynette, “who do you say that I am?”
I know that Jesus exists on this earth, for He resides on the throne of my heart; I have as yet to fully open all the doors that would lead to Him revealing the kingdom fully in my heart and therefore my life.

For where your treasure is, there will be your heart be also. Luke: 12:34

Billy.