But was Jesus obvious and was his tactic one full of purpose? (Main Forum)
Vynette, I understand what you are saying and I know that this question as to what scripture actually says about Jesus' divinity is one which has become a major issue in modern scripture scholarship not to mention church history. And one could ask why Jesus himself wasn't less cryptic about who he was.
But you see I suppose I have a problem with a mere man saying such things as "I am the way the truth and the life; no can come to the father except through me." John 14:6. Or, "unless you eat my flesh and drink my blood you shall not have life within you." (John 6:53) And, "If you knew the gift of God, and who it is that says to you, Give me to drink; you would have asked of him, and he would have given you living water" (John 4:10). How can any man/woman say such things, demand such intimacy and allegiance?. How could any mere mortal say that he could forgive sins especially in the context of his culture and religion. I suppose that's at the heart of my questions and that's at the heart of later theological/traditional developments as to who this Jesus was/is.
I wish Jesus had just come out in black and white statement and said he was God. Why didn't he or why didn't he come out with a black and white statement to say he wasn't God?
I wonder if the reason is that he wanted us to make the choice, the leap of faith and for ourselves, to make a decision as to "who do you say I am". And in making that choice we embark on the life of faith, the type that stretches us and pushes us into creative dimensions of living we can only dream of had we not, a life to the full which knowing through certainty can never bring us. Could that be what this is all about?
Stephen
![]()
Oh yet we trust that somehow good
Will be the final goal of ill
Complete thread:
- Salvation string (Moved to the front page again) - Brian Coyne, 2010-02-05, 02:26
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- Some questions to herbie - PeterR, 2010-01-29, 19:27
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- Just letting you know I'm ok - herbie, 2010-01-29, 22:06
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- Just letting you know I''ve done it - herbie, 2010-01-30, 01:24
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- Just letting you know - Liz, 2010-01-30, 11:07
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- Just letting you know I''ve done it - for which I am grateful. - PeterR, 2010-01-30, 13:53
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- A question for Peter (and others) - ray(O), 2010-01-30, 14:18
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- A question for Peter (and others) - PeterR, 2010-01-30, 14:26
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- Re: Printing - Veronica, 2010-01-30, 16:33
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- A question for Peter (and others) - PeterR, 2010-01-30, 14:26
- A bit of (impossible) forgotten salvation history - PeterR, 2010-01-30, 14:23
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- Just letting you know I''ve done it - for which I am grateful. - Brian Coyne, 2010-01-30, 14:23
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- SOME (POTENTIALLY) FUNDAMENTALIST THEMES IN SALVATION HISTORY - PeterR, 2010-01-31, 12:41
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- A question for Peter (and others) - ray(O), 2010-01-30, 14:18
- Article on the pottery shard to which herbie referred - PeterR, 2010-01-30, 17:08
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- Article on the pottery shard to which herbie referred - Brian Coyne, 2010-01-30, 18:49
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- A question from Vynette - vynette, 2010-01-30, 20:14
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- Scripture as blueprint for navigating Life... - Brian Coyne, 2010-01-30, 23:40
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- Scripture as blueprint for navigating Life... - Englishwoman, 2010-01-31, 17:59
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- Scripture as blueprint for navigating Life... - Brian Coyne, 2010-01-31, 23:56
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- Scripture as blueprint for navigating Life... - Kaiser, 2010-02-01, 06:35
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- Scripture as blueprint for navigating Life... - Englishwoman, 2010-02-01, 06:44
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- Scripture as blueprint for navigating Life... - gemstones, 2010-02-01, 09:22
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- Scripture as blueprint for navigating Life... - Brian Coyne, 2010-02-01, 11:02
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- Scripture as blueprint for navigating Life... - Brian Coyne, 2010-02-01, 11:02
- Scripture as blueprint for navigating Life... - gemstones, 2010-02-01, 09:22
- "Junking" Israel's history... - vynette, 2010-02-01, 11:21
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- "Junking" Israel's history... - Brian Coyne, 2010-02-01, 16:00
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- "Junking" Israel's history... - vynette, 2010-02-01, 17:36
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- "Junking" Israel's history... - PeterR, 2010-02-01, 19:25
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- "Junking" Israel's history... - Brian Coyne, 2010-02-01, 20:53
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- "Junking" Israel's history... - PeterR, 2010-02-01, 19:25
- "Junking" Israel's history... - vynette, 2010-02-01, 17:36
- "Junking" Israel's history... a point of clarification - herbie, 2010-02-02, 11:17
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- "Junking" Israel's history... - Brian Coyne, 2010-02-01, 16:00
- Scripture as blueprint for navigating Life... - Englishwoman, 2010-02-01, 06:44
- Scripture as blueprint for navigating Life... - PeterR, 2010-02-01, 09:41
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- Scripture as blueprint for navigating Life... - Kaiser, 2010-02-01, 06:35
- Scripture as blueprint for navigating Life... - Brian Coyne, 2010-01-31, 23:56
- What is salvation? Where does Jesus fit in? - Part 1 - PeterR, 2010-02-01, 15:56
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- What is salvation? Where does Jesus fit in? - Part 2 - PeterR, 2010-02-01, 16:04
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- What is salvation? Where does Jesus fit in? - Part 2 - Brian Coyne, 2010-02-01, 23:42
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- Schillebeeckx: No salvation outside the world - PeterR, 2010-02-02, 16:11
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- What is salvation? Where does Jesus fit in? - Part 2 - Brian Coyne, 2010-02-01, 23:42
- What is salvation? Where does Jesus fit in? - Part 2 - PeterR, 2010-02-01, 16:04
- As they say - "The question still remains".... - Oh Yet We Trust, 2010-02-03, 20:23
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- White and very obvious.... - vynette, 2010-02-04, 16:37
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- But was Jesus obvious and was his tactic one full of purpose? - Oh Yet We Trust, 2010-02-04, 18:57
- a suggestion - old robe, 2010-02-05, 07:55
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- a suggestion - Oh Yet We Trust, 2010-02-05, 10:43
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- an answer that isn't! - old robe, 2010-02-05, 12:02
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- an answer that isn't!....TGIF tangent! - Liz, 2010-02-05, 13:38
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- an answer that isn't!....TGIF tangent! - old robe, 2010-02-05, 14:47
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- an answer that isn't!....TGIF tangent! - old robe, 2010-02-05, 14:47
- an answer that isn't!....TGIF tangent! - Liz, 2010-02-05, 13:38
- an answer that isn't! - old robe, 2010-02-05, 12:02
- a suggestion - Oh Yet We Trust, 2010-02-05, 10:43
- Yes...to Jews - vynette, 2010-02-05, 10:41
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- Yes., I'd like that. - Oh Yet We Trust, 2010-02-05, 11:17
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- Yes., I'd like that. - Oh Yet We Trust, 2010-02-05, 11:17
- a suggestion - old robe, 2010-02-05, 07:55
- But was Jesus obvious and was his tactic one full of purpose? - Oh Yet We Trust, 2010-02-04, 18:57
- White and very obvious.... - vynette, 2010-02-04, 16:37
- Scripture as blueprint for navigating Life... - Englishwoman, 2010-01-31, 17:59
- Scripture as blueprint for navigating Life... - Brian Coyne, 2010-01-30, 23:40
- A question from Vynette - vynette, 2010-01-30, 20:14
- Article on the pottery shard to which herbie referred - Brian Coyne, 2010-01-30, 18:49
- Just letting you know - Liz, 2010-01-30, 11:07
- Just letting you know I''ve done it - herbie, 2010-01-30, 01:24
- Some may find some answers here. The above thread in a broader context. - Oh Yet We Trust, 2010-02-02, 09:32
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- The third article, (with a little extra) - Oh Yet We Trust, 2010-02-02, 09:33
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- A little more of an explanation of why I posted these articles here. - Oh Yet We Trust, 2010-02-02, 11:00
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- A reflection - Oh Yet We Trust, 2010-02-02, 14:08
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- Life in the Age to Come - vynette, 2010-02-02, 16:20
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- I'm interested! - Oh Yet We Trust, 2010-02-02, 17:44
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- I'm interested! - vynette, 2010-02-02, 18:33
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- More meat please, Vynette (and Herbie and Ian et al). - Oh Yet We Trust, 2010-02-02, 19:27
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- More meat please, Vynette (and Herbie and Ian et al). - Oh Yet We Trust, 2010-02-02, 19:27
- I'm interested! - vynette, 2010-02-02, 18:33
- I'm interested! - Oh Yet We Trust, 2010-02-02, 17:44
- A reflection - Oh Yet We Trust, 2010-02-02, 14:08
- The third article, (with a little extra) - Oh Yet We Trust, 2010-02-02, 09:33
- From salvation to sin and confession - PeterR, 2010-02-04, 12:29
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- DISCOVERY: ALL OF "NEBUCHADNEZZARS'S DREAM" IS ON THE NET - PeterR, 2010-02-04, 13:15
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- DISCOVERY: ALL OF "NEBUCHADNEZZARS'S DREAM" IS ON THE NET - Brian Coyne, 2010-02-04, 15:28
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- DISCOVERY: ALL OF "NEBUCHADNEZZARS'S DREAM" IS ON THE NET - Francis, 2010-02-04, 19:02
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- DISCOVERY: ALL OF "NEBUCHADNEZZARS'S DREAM" IS ON THE NET - Francis, 2010-02-04, 19:02
- Downhill from Brian ... threatening skies .... - Veronica, 2010-02-04, 16:06
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- Downhill from Brian ... threatening skies .... - PeterR, 2010-02-04, 17:37
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- Downhill from Brian ... threatening skies .... - PeterR, 2010-02-04, 17:37
- DISCOVERY: ALL OF "NEBUCHADNEZZARS'S DREAM" IS ON THE NET - Brian Coyne, 2010-02-04, 15:28
- From salvation to sin and confession - Helen, 2010-02-04, 15:50
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- From salvation to sin and confession - PeterR, 2010-02-04, 17:39
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- From salvation to sin and confession - PeterR, 2010-02-04, 17:39
- Not in Nebuchadnezzar's presence - herbie, 2010-02-04, 23:11
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- What actually is 'salvation'? - Brian Coyne, 2010-02-04, 23:48
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- What actually is 'salvation'? - vynette, 2010-02-05, 15:33
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- What actually is 'salvation'? - Brian Coyne, 2010-02-05, 16:08
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- Obedience - PeterR, 2010-02-05, 17:36
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- Peter, it IS a subtle distinction... - Brian Coyne, 2010-02-05, 18:54
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- Peter, it IS a subtle distinction... - Brian Coyne, 2010-02-05, 18:54
- What actually is 'salvation'? - vynette, 2010-02-07, 09:58
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- He might have been Son of God but was He God incarnate? - Oh Yet We Trust, 2010-02-07, 11:01
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- No... - vynette, 2010-02-07, 14:16
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- Author! Author! - Oh Yet We Trust, 2010-02-07, 15:49
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- "Was Jesus Divine?" - Liz, 2010-02-07, 18:32
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- "Was Jesus Divine?"...again "No" - vynette, 2010-02-08, 07:49
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- "Was Jesus Divine?" What does this mean? - Liz, 2010-02-08, 13:09
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- "Was Jesus Divine?" What does this mean? - vynette, 2010-02-08, 14:10
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- "Was Jesus Divine?" What does this mean? - Liz, 2010-02-08, 15:23
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- "Was Jesus Divine?" What does this mean? - vynette, 2010-02-08, 20:27
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- "Was Jesus Divine?" What does this mean? - vynette, 2010-02-08, 20:27
- "Was Jesus Divine?" What does this mean? - Liz, 2010-02-08, 15:23
- "Was Jesus Divine?" What does this mean? - vynette, 2010-02-08, 14:10
- "Was Jesus Divine?" What does this mean? - Liz, 2010-02-08, 13:09
- "Was Jesus Divine?"...again "No" - vynette, 2010-02-08, 07:49
- "Was Jesus Divine?" - Liz, 2010-02-07, 18:32
- Author! Author! - Oh Yet We Trust, 2010-02-07, 15:49
- No... - vynette, 2010-02-07, 14:16
- What actually is 'salvation'? - Brian Coyne, 2010-02-07, 15:58
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- He might have been Son of God but was He God incarnate? - Oh Yet We Trust, 2010-02-07, 11:01
- Obedience - PeterR, 2010-02-05, 17:36
- Does anyone want Jesus to be God? This is big stuff for me. - Oh Yet We Trust, 2010-02-05, 18:25
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- Does anyone want Jesus to be God? This is big stuff for me. - Liz, 2010-02-05, 19:31
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- Some thoughts in response to your question... - Brian Coyne, 2010-02-06, 03:13
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- Some thoughts in response to your question... - Oh Yet We Trust, 2010-02-06, 04:41
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- Some thoughts in response to your question... - Brian Coyne, 2010-02-06, 11:12
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- When did Christians first believe Jesus was the Son of God? - Oh Yet We Trust, 2010-02-06, 11:27
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- When did Christians first believe Jesus was the Son of God? - Oh Yet We Trust, 2010-02-06, 11:27
- Some thoughts in response to your question... - Brian Coyne, 2010-02-06, 11:12
- Some thoughts in response to your question... - Oh Yet We Trust, 2010-02-06, 04:41
- Does anyone want Jesus to be God? This is big stuff for me. - Liz, 2010-02-05, 19:31
- What actually is 'salvation'? - Brian Coyne, 2010-02-05, 16:08
- What actually is 'salvation'? - vynette, 2010-02-05, 15:33
- What actually is 'salvation'? - Brian Coyne, 2010-02-04, 23:48
- From child/parent to brother/sister in Christ concepts of sin and salvation. - Oh Yet We Trust, 2010-02-05, 10:12
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- The origins, and meaning, of the story of the Fall... - Brian Coyne, 2010-02-07, 16:41
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- Hide and/or Seek (and Find) - it's up to us: We're free to choose. - Oh Yet We Trust, 2010-02-07, 18:24
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- Hide and/or Seek (and Find) - it's up to us: We're free to choose. - Oh Yet We Trust, 2010-02-07, 18:24
- The origins, and meaning, of the story of the Fall... - Brian Coyne, 2010-02-07, 16:41
- DISCOVERY: ALL OF "NEBUCHADNEZZARS'S DREAM" IS ON THE NET - PeterR, 2010-02-04, 13:15
- After all that, what is salvation? - PeterR, 2010-02-06, 17:19
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- Just letting you know I'm ok - herbie, 2010-01-29, 22:06
- Salvation string (Moved to the front page again) - Tom McMahon, 2010-02-09, 10:19
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- Some questions to herbie - PeterR, 2010-01-29, 19:27

















